Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby xrick » Sat Apr 28, 2012 11:14 am

I finally managed to find the topic, didn't know you were already aquainted with Orakio and his team.
Your progress is looking great, congratulations.
Also, it's too bad that the menu letters (Character Name, Techs, Items) have yet to be properly cracked in regards of font width (the brazilian group is also having the same problem), it's always irritating (at least to me) to have to see the names of things all abreviated so it all fits.


Also, there are a few things about the translation that I'd prefer to see done right, if possible (I'm not sure I'm using the right words, sorry)...

Character Names:
Please, translate them literally, if possible, I don't want the American ones (Alis, Odin, Noah, Lassic), I simply hate them.
Alisa, Tylon, Lutz, La Shiec, Dark Falz (it's Phallus, but I prefer Falz, as it's used nowadays), those are the proper names.

Magic Names:
As the font width on this section is still not properly programmable, I understand, but that as well I'd prefer the proper names to be used.
Google Translate is not a definite tool for such translations and I believe the PS4 magic names were correct, Flaeli, Tandle, Hewn, etc...
I made a list of my own, using PS4 and my short understanding of katakana to translate the names, if you want I can post it here later.

Planet Names:
That one was a big question to me as well until a week ago, when I came here to check the compendium on a whim.
The proper names are these: Parma, Motabia, Dezolis. The cutscene on Gaila in PSG:2 clearly shows the names in english.


This whole thing of sticking to the classic american wordings only for nostalgia fanservice, I think it's outdated, we should stick with the original namings.
Well, Perolimate & Ruoginin I can accept see them changed to Monomate & Dimate, it goes better with the Trimate and the Fluids.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby Kyence » Sat Apr 28, 2012 2:15 pm

Thank you for your interest in the translation!

The font widths were tricky, yes. I am not a big fan of abbreviations myself; early on I found out that even if I wrote them out, they extended past the frames and such. After experimentation, I decided upon a maximum of nine letters for items; I then had to rewrite every item, essentially crush them together to make space for the additional letters, then adjust their pointers once I found them. For the items and such, this seemed to be a good mix of knowing what the item is and fitting in with the aesthetics. The game also features a description option for each item, so that helps.

The spells...ah, yes,I did not like having to rename them. They come with descriptions, though, so it's not a complete loss.

I posted earlier back at the PS4 spell names.Frankly, after looking at the katakana myself, I found quite a few of them to be wrong. Those I did not need Google Translate for, haha! Flaeli could easily be interpreted as "Flare" with the same letters; I have seen that the last katakana letter is sometimes arbitrary in the final "vowel" sound it makes versus the original English word it's from. Tandle is clearly supposed to be "Thunder" - since there is no difference between "r" and "l" in katakana, unless you say it, you'd miss it. Bindwa--Bind, I think they were trying to emphasize the "d" at the end when it's said in English. There's a few others. Unfortunately,the formatting on the status page only allowed me four to five letters tops per spell.

In regards to the Big Bad: I think the katakana is most likely Force; it looks like Falz, but Japanese does not have "rce" in its language. Much like "th"as in "three" is often written as a "za-" or "ze-" sound. They are adapting English words to Japanese. But, I prefer the original source spelling when dealing with English, which is Force. Phallus is another word that can definitely come from the katakana spelling,and I have seen debate on this one. It never occurred to me until I saw it being discussed. I definitely laughed...a lot. It figures that Japan could make a double entendre like that in a video game. In this version, Phallus could work, since he has a giant, pulsing [rhymes with Mulva] on his forehead!! How did this series avoid being a Hentai anime in Japan? I don't know how, but I am glad it did. I chalk up the "falz" spelling in PSO these days either as an homage to the ambiguous kana, or lazy translators.

Much like how in the US, people screw up kanji all the time, I have seen enough katakana on products to see that things get missed.

The Planet Names were decided on a consensus in this forum a while back. This translation is essentially for the fans,so I wanted their input.

The names were tricky. I have seen Odin's Japanese name translated as Tyrone and Tylon; I would go more with the former. The "ah" sound in Tylon would be done more with the "a" kana, where a "ro" pronounced a "row" is used. I have read that "Tyron"is a name variant of Tyrone. I remember seeing La Shiec's name in PS4 for the first time and blurting out: "When did Lassic become French?!" This was before I knew any Japanese, hehe. I prefer Lutz myself;Alisa I don't mind either one; Odin-just got screwed no matter what language his name's in, but he wields a big axe so don't tell him I said that!

The biggest breu-haha I've seen in regards to their names is the Noah/Lutz, which is an easy enough change to make. The others, being more than 5 letters, again goes into that whole fitting in bit. This is my first time hacking anything,really, and I have learned first-hand the frustrations of dealing with compiled code; no scripting to give you hints, lots of trial and error. The pointers and the offset calculation - I found that out by myself, by mistake, after randomly putting null values in what looked like pointers and seeing what happened. I thank my RL career for giving me the patience and systematic methods I used to get as far as I had without nagging Orakiorob about everything. I finally had something to contribute back to him! I am certain that had this game been properly released in English, the formatting and space required in menus would have easily been altered. Alas, not so for a novice romhacker like me.

We are all entitled to our opinions on this classic series. However, your quip in regards to nostalgia fanservice - I have no delusion that this is somehow going to go viral and a generation of kids is going to play this game for the first time:) I am doing this for myself and for fans because nostalgia IS my fuel. If more than one person (including myself) plays this game, I will consider my labor of love well worth the time spent. I bought the disc years ago - and waited ten years for someone on the planet to translate the darned thing. Billions of people-not one did it. So, I figured I'd give it a whirl - and now I'm 30% complete with the event text and everything else is translated already.

I wish I could answer all of your concerns and make the game with everything you specified, but I had to make some choices. I am leaving everything decompressed, so if anybody would like to change it, they can. I sought advice from fans here at PSCAVE (I tried PSALGO, too, but they must have thought I was a troll or something,because I never got any replies), and used that. The spells-those were judgment calls.

As an English-speaking fan, I'd like to finish with this. It has been obvious from the start of the series we also ended up with the crappiest translations, the ambiguous changes to items and spells (I did get rid of Cola and Burger), the retconning that never makes it to our version...thanks to Sega of America and Sega of Japan. But you know what? Decades later, we still have fond memories of these games despite their flaws because as a whole they made up for it. I think we waited long enough for this game to be played in any form of English- heck, if it came out in Pig Latin, I would've payed for it! If my piddling translation is used as a foundation for more experienced romhackers to overcome the obstacles and make it more "authentic", I will be satisfied.

Sorry for the long post. I hope you will still be interested in playing the game. If not, maybe you will can find romhackers to make the changes. The more versions, the better, I say :D

Eesay ouyay aterlay! :mrgreen:
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby BenoitRen » Sat Apr 28, 2012 2:28 pm

xrick wrote:Planet Names:
That one was a big question to me as well until a week ago, when I came here to check the compendium on a whim.
The proper names are these: Parma, Motabia, Dezolis. The cutscene on Gaila in PSG:2 clearly shows the names in english.

All of the names are "correct". It's the usual ambiguity with B/V and L/R. Other material like one of the Phantasy Star II text adventures uses "Motavia", for example.
Kyence wrote:In regards to the Big Bad: I think the katakana is most likely Force; it looks like Falz, but Japanese does not have "rce" in its language.

According to another translator they would have used "fosu" if they meant Force instead of "farusu".
I chalk up the "falz" spelling in PSO these days either as an homage to the ambiguous kana, or lazy translators.

The original Phantasy Star also used "Dark Falz", so there is a precedent for that spelling.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby xrick » Sat Apr 28, 2012 2:46 pm

Kyence, I have no issues with your work, it means alot already that someone (and alone) is trying to do what the Americans couldn't because of their policies of limiting the number of 2D games localised from Japan (PSG:1's review on Gazeta explained this and I'm grateful for it)...

It's just that the "fans", I believe, should try to see beyond the many flaws of the classics and let the original content be brought in it's entirety instead of only going on the nostalgia bandwagon. Anyway, I seem to be alone on this one so this is as far as I can get without getting anyone angry at me.

Both you and Orakio's team are doing a great job, nonetheless, on this project and I hope someone really moves onto PSG:2.

Also, in case you didn't notice, on my signature there's a link to a SEGA Forum post of mine where I'm trying to gather as many voices of fans of the Classics (and Generations), trying to make SEGA see that there's many people yearning for a proper localisation of these games (and if possible the completion of the trilogy, namely PS4Remake) but so far few people have gone there... There's also links for online petitions and stuff, you can go check if you want.

Well, for now this is all, thanks for your time answering my post.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby Kyence » Sat Apr 28, 2012 2:56 pm

The "falz" spelling versus "fosu" could have been an error on the translator's part. There are plenty of sites devoted to the grammar and spelling errors of the games of yore:)

I've also heard that sometimes English fonts are used as a design element because they "look cool" - much how you'll find Japanese and Chinese lettering on American products and they are literal jibberish. Maybe the translator thought the "Falz" spelling looked cool, and the program checker didn't notice or care As the English translations have made many groan, it's not that hard a stretch to think it started out that way as well. Translators on either shore are not infallible.

Or, Falz is just a "fantasy" name, much as how we create all sort of weird names with tons of apostrophes in English. So, it may be a homage/precedent these days, which is fine. I can change it to Falz if anyone really objects to "Force."

I'm just glad I don't have to change it to "Dark Schlong!"

So, what does everyone feel about this? Should I type it as Dark Falz, or Dark Force?

xrick wrote:Kyence, I have no issues with your work, it means alot already that someone (and alone) is trying to do what the Americans couldn't because of their policies of limiting the number of 2D games localised from Japan (PSG:1's review on Gazeta explained this and I'm grateful for it)...

It's just that the "fans", I believe, should try to see beyond the many flaws of the classics and let the original content be brought in it's entirety instead of only going on the nostalgia bandwagon. Anyway, I seem to be alone on this one so this is as far as I can get without getting anyone angry at me.

Both you and Orakio's team are doing a great job, nonetheless, on this project and I hope someone really moves onto PSG:2.

Also, in case you didn't notice, on my signature there's a link to a SEGA Forum post of mine where I'm trying to gather as many voices of fans of the Classics (and Generations), trying to make SEGA see that there's many people yearning for a proper localisation of these games (and if possible the completion of the trilogy, namely PS4Remake) but so far few people have gone there... There's also links for online petitions and stuff, you can go check if you want.

Well, for now this is all, thanks for your time answering my post.


I appreciate your input! I am not angry at you, I apologize if my post comes across like that. It was an opportunity for people to see a bit more into the decisions I made in translating the game thus far. As a fan of the earlier Final Fantasy series, it's always irked me to see those games get remade (I'd still buy them and replay them, because they always added extra stuff) after remake over the years and consoles while PS fans get stuck with simple ports, if that. I'd love to see SEGA finish remaking them and bring them over here, even as a Download from the PSN! (I'd also love to play the Dragon Force remakes in English,too). I hope your petition gets a response from SEGA.

We can agree to disagree on the fans bit. We are discussing our differing opinions in a civil manner, so that's fine.
Last edited by Kyence on Sat Apr 28, 2012 3:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby xrick » Sat Apr 28, 2012 3:27 pm

Don't worry, I'm not angry, not even close, nor have I a reason to do that, I'm not the one doing the translation project, so it's not my call.

About the fans' side, it's really sad but there's not much I can do about that as well.

Also, about the number of characters in the menus, isn't possible to make two lines for each item/magic/etc? I remember the SMSPower of PS1 managed to do that splendidly.

Also again, about the names of the planets, I'm also using the names of the planets of PSU as a reference, since the three of them (Parum, Moatoob, Newdaiz) are a possible reference to the Classic ones.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby BenoitRen » Sat Apr 28, 2012 6:19 pm

xrick wrote:t's just that the "fans", I believe, should try to see beyond the many flaws of the classics and let the original content be brought in it's entirety instead of only going on the nostalgia bandwagon.

What is this supposed to mean? Are you trying to say that we should stop clinging to the originals and embrace these remakes that bring the original content in its entirety?

You do realise that these are budget remakes, right? You do realise that the original team didn't work on these, right? There's no way this can be the complete original content.

Not to mention that PSG1 completely misses what made the original what it is.
and if possible the completion of the trilogy, namely PS4Remake

There's no point in remaking a game for the sole purpose of remaking it.
Kyence wrote:The "falz" spelling versus "fosu" could have been an error on the translator's part.

I'm not sure you understood what I meant. The katakana used is "farusu", which can be transliterated as either "Falz" or "Phallus". The point is that you wouldn't transliterate that into "Force". The katakana that would transliterate to "Force" is "fosu".
xrick wrote:Also, about the number of characters in the menus, isn't possible to make two lines for each item/magic/etc? I remember the SMSPower of PS1 managed to do that splendidly.

SMS Power! achieved that by hacking the game's assembler code, which is an order of magnitude harder than what Kyence is doing.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby xrick » Sat Apr 28, 2012 6:32 pm

BenoitRen wrote:What is this supposed to mean? Are you trying to say that we should stop clinging to the originals and embrace these remakes that bring the original content in its entirety?

You do realise that these are budget remakes, right? You do realise that the original team didn't work on these, right? There's no way this can be the complete original content.

Not to mention that PSG1 completely misses what made the original what it is.

Then what does PSG:1 misses? Care to explain?
And what about being a budget remake? That doesn't make it less amazing and a nice enhancement of the original game, in my opinion.
Not only it have all of the content of the original game, it also have new text, with the Consult option, with which the characters were more fleshed out and developed. Also, there's new stuff in-game, like one of the Motabian villages having only Motabians, a nice addition, in my opinion again.
Also, I'm not saying to discard the Classics, that's impossible. I'm only taking about the bad translations made by SOA at the time which I believe should be left behind and allow this translation to bring up all that both the original and the remake games wanted to convey to us.
There's no point in remaking a game for the sole purpose of remaking it.

You seem to not like the budget remakes but there are people who do, like me, and I wanted to see that great game remade, specially with the graphics and character design of nowadays. I loved the designs of the two existing games.
SMS Power! achieved that by hacking the game's assembler code, which is an order of magnitude harder than what Kyence is doing.

I understand the level of coding is different from the Classics, I just stated a possibility. It's not like it may be impossible, maybe just hard enough.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby BenoitRen » Sat Apr 28, 2012 7:02 pm

xrick wrote:Then what does PSG:1 misses? Care to explain?

  • The game has been made linear by requiring a differently coloured key for every dungeon that must be acquired in sequence.
  • Lots of mandatory talking with villagers.
In essence, they changed the freeform nature of the original.
And what about being a budget remake? That doesn't make it less amazing and a nice enhancement of the original game, on my opinion.

It shows that this is a budget remake by how little effort has gone into it. It doesn't do the original game justice.
You seem to not like the budget remakes but there are people who do, like me, and I wanted to see that great game remade, specially with the graphics and character design of nowadays. I loved the designs of the two existing games.

The point of a remake is to fix what was broken in the original and make the rest even better with today's technology. Apart from being easy there's nothing to improve on in Phantasy Star IV, so there's no point in remaking it.

I didn't like the redesigns much, especially not PSG2's. PSG1's character designs were passable, save for Myau's. PSG2's character designs, though, range from passable to atrocious. The artistic direction is lazy and generic, a far cry from Yoshida's designs.

A new coat of paint is a horrible reason to remake a game if you ask me.
I understand the level of coding is different from the Classics

That's not what I was saying. There's a difference between translating a game's text and reprogramming a game to fit more text on the screen.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby xrick » Sat Apr 28, 2012 8:29 pm

BenoitRen wrote:
  • The game has been made linear by requiring a differently coloured key for every dungeon that must be acquired in sequence.
  • Lots of mandatory talking with villagers.
In essence, they changed the freeform nature of the original.

That freeform nature may have made many gamers lose their way in the original game, to me, it was a good decision, it makes the game have a sort of continuous plot.
It shows that this is a budget remake by how little effort has gone into it. It doesn't do the original game justice.

The Final Fantasy Classics also had enhanced remakes that changed little to the games and yet they look better than the original ones.
To me, PSG:1&2 are on the same level.
The point of a remake is to fix what was broken in the original and make the rest even better with today's technology. Apart from being easy there's nothing to improve on in Phantasy Star IV, so there's no point in remaking it.

I didn't like the redesigns much, especially not PSG2's. PSG1's character designs were passable, save for Myau's. PSG2's character designs, though, range from passable to atrocious. The artistic direction is lazy and generic, a far cry from Yoshida's designs.

A new coat of paint is a horrible reason to remake a game if you ask me.

PS4 may not seem to have much to "fix" but at least it'd be remade with a style more akin to nowadays 2D games and possibly could gain a few more texts to flesh out even better the cast and so on. Besides, the game was in the list of 3D AGES since the very beginning, that's a fact you can't change, so it was to be remade as well, no matter how much you think it didn't need a remake. Even nowadays it makes me sad it didn't go through...
To me, both games look better than the original ones, and yes, PSG:2 cutscenes may have become a bit sloppy here and there, but the character arts, I love them, a great redesign of those retro designs, and for PS4 I wanted the same. You like retro, I like modern and remake.


Also, Kyence, just for curiosity's sake, here's my list of PS1/PSG:1 Magic Names as I tried to translate the best I could:
Flaeli (フレエリ Fureeri)
GiFlaeli (ギフレエリ GiFureeri)
Froze (フローゼ Furooze)
RaFroze (ラフローゼ RaFurooze)
Hewn (ヒューン Hyuun)
GiHewn (ギヒューン GiHyuun)
Tandle (タンドレ Tandore)
GiTandle (ギタンドレ GiTandore)
Heal (ヒール Hiiru)
DoHeal (ドヒール DoHiiru)
GiHeal (ギヒール GiHiiru)
RaHeal (ラヒール RaHiiru)
Cuara (キュアラ Kyuara)
Rebirth (リーバス Riibasu)
Bindwa (ビンドワ Bindowa)
Hypnos (ヒプノス Hipunosu)
Telele (テルル Teruru)
Silence (サイレンス Sairensu)
Warla (ワーラ Waara)
MuWarla (ムワーラ MuWaara)
Pawma (パウマ Pauma)
Raksta (ラクスタ Rakusuta)
Troopa (トルーパ Toruupa)
Srut (スルト Suruto)
Raptto (ラプット Raputto)
MuOrde (ムオーデ Muoode)
Last edited by xrick on Wed May 02, 2012 10:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby BenoitRen » Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:25 pm

xrick wrote:That freeform nature may have made many gamers lose their way in the original game

That's not a good reason to make it linear. There are other, better and less invasive ways of helping such gamers.
to me, it was a good decision, it makes the game have a sort of continuous plot

It's not worth changing the original game for. If you want this kind of game, go play a Final Fantasy. Phantasy Star has its own identity and I don't think it's appropriate to change it for the sake of making it look like every other RPG.
The Final Fantasy Classics also had enhanced remakes that changed little to the games and yet they look better than the original ones.

That doesn't mean anything.
PS4 may not seem to have much to "fix" but at least it'd be remade with a style more akin to nowadays 2D games

What would be the point of that?
possibly could gain a few more texts to flesh out even better the cast

The original game did a good job of that already.
Besides, the game was in the list of 3D AGES since the very beginning, that's a fact you can't change

You also can't change the fact that it was cancelled.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby Tryphon » Sun Apr 29, 2012 3:05 pm

Just an idea for the 4-letters-names problem : since longest names are only 5 characters (Alisa, Tyron(e)) and text in the game is encoded with a big coding scheme (part of SHIFT-JIS, likely thousands of characters), why not using 4 character slots to create 4 special "characters" that contains the drawing of a complete name ?

Visually, it may not be so ugly...
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby xrick » Sun Apr 29, 2012 3:39 pm

Benoit, I won't argue with you any longer, you'll always try to degrade the remakes no matter what, I'm not here to do that but to try to help Kyence as much as I can. But I wonder what you're doing here, anyway, since you don't like the remakes...
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby Missagh » Sun Apr 29, 2012 4:33 pm

You like retro, I like modern and remake.

That sums it up. Benoit you have made your point and so has xrick, there is no point to further explore your different opinions on this matter.

Thanks again for the update Kyence! I am sure that you are aware that there are many old school fans out there that are waiting for this translation that do not engage in these forums. Some are on the FB page and many just browse the main pages of PS Cave for updates. I look forward to the next video!
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation:1 English translation project

Postby BenoitRen » Sun Apr 29, 2012 6:32 pm

xrick wrote:But I wonder what you're doing here, anyway, since you don't like the remakes...

As a moderator, it is my duty to watch all threads.
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