Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

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How should the main characters be named in Generation:2 ?

Poll ended at Fri Oct 19, 2012 1:51 am

Use the full Japanese names
28
38%
Use the English Sega Genesis names
40
55%
It doesn't matter
5
7%
 
Total votes : 73

Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby BenoitRen » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:57 pm

You should not ignore it. You should work it into your translation somehow.
Zio51 wrote:If I were to find somzthing that has the same vibe in Europe, I would say like how Belgian people often say "Une fois" at the end of their sentences.

Here at home we use "Un peu" instead. I don't remember the reason at the moment.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Blaw- » Fri Aug 02, 2013 12:48 am

Well, I won't do like fansubs team which put "dattebayo" at the end of their english sentence (and for the ones who put "dammit/damn" at the end, same, because it's not really what it mean).

I'm still waiting to ask a japanese friend about it but I suppose she'll say to just remove it, as we have nothing in french which would be useful here (especially, when there is two, one when they lie, and one when they don't), and Dezolians don't seem to be belgium peoples so it would be weird to see them say "une fois" ou "un peu" ;)
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby BenoitRen » Fri Aug 02, 2013 10:02 am

It seems to be some kind of tick like how people append "yes" or "right" at the end of their sentence in some region, so that's one option.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Blaw- » Fri Aug 02, 2013 11:44 am

It's just a part of japanese language, they have some things other languages don't have and they don't have things some other languages have.

Those kinds of words at the end of a sentence don't change the meaning of the sentence.

It's like the variation of japanese depending of the region, they have different dialects (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_dialects).
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby BenoitRen » Fri Aug 02, 2013 11:14 pm

Other languages have dialects, too.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Blaw- » Sat Aug 03, 2013 11:33 am

Of course, but not sure every language still use them usually like they do there (In france, dialects are not really used anymore, except mainly by some old peoples, it's dissapearing, even the learning of it is dissapearing).
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Zio51 » Sat Aug 03, 2013 12:52 pm

Blaw- wrote:Of course, but not sure every language still use them usually like they do there (In france, dialects are not really used anymore, except mainly by some old peoples, it's dissapearing, even the learning of it is dissapearing).

I would not completely agree with this. I doubt that dialect are really actively taught in Japan, neither are they used a lot anymore in Japan as well. It is only that it is present in medias and therefore appears like it is of actuality.

In my opinion, Japan feel pretty similar to France in those aspects.
In terms of dialects, it is likely a spilt countryside/city more than anything else. I could be wrong but it seems to be a fairly logical consequence of urbanisation: people from many different regions converge therefore the need for a standardisation in the communication follow suit (not necessarily at the hand of the government, people instinctively try to adapt their surrounding).

Likewise rural parts tend to resist this longer simply because they are not the point of convergence. Not that they completely espace it and the overtime trend is for a withering of dialects as a purely a "dialect" as it gets swallowed by common language and become part of it. You could say dialects are being assimilated by the "common" tongue.

Anyway Japan just insists more about it in medias. But for example we had the film Les Ch'tis in France not so long in the past that was like a showcase of this. Also reference to the differences "south/north" is pretty emphasized in French media(mainly because of the accent difference) , similar to Kanto/Kansai emphasis in Japan media.

Well my true opinion is that almost all indistrialised nations follow this pattern eventually. But I'm only regarding this in a mathemacial, logical way.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Blaw- » Sun Aug 04, 2013 12:45 am

I never say they were actively taught, but from what I heard from friends living there, it heavily more used than in france, though there is only one who is really used, which is Kansai-ben (Osaka), so you'll mostly find people taking Kansai-ben in Osaka.

But I think you would be surprised to see some dialects still commonly used in Japan in real life, compared to a lot of other countries.

In french, like in the film you quoted, it's just used a cliché, and it's about the accent, not the language. North peoples have a different accent than south ones (and some regions don't have any accents) but they still use standard french. I personally never saw someone using a dialect in my life, even very old people (except a few words which can differ depending of where they live, but it's quite rare).

Here's something I found about japanese people talking about the use of dialects (so mainly kansai ben) :

Question :

How often is Kansai-ben (dialect) used in Osaka?
I want to study abroad in Japan and I may go to Osaka. I want to learn standard japanese that is spoken throughout most of the country.

So conversationally how often do Japanese people speak Kansai-ben in Osaka. (I mean in everyday situations and not just in the media.)?

Also how different is kansai-ben and is it frequently written down. (like in textbooks in osaka universities.) ?

Any info from japanese people or people who have studied in japanese universities would be most appriciated!!!!


Answer :

I was born and have grown up in Tokyo.
People who has grown in Osaka usually speak Kansai-ben.
So many people speak Kansai-ben in Osaka.
But when writing, almost every Japanese people use standard Japanese.
Books are always written in standard one throughout the country.

For non-Japanese people, probably Kansai-ben is rather different from standard.
(Of course, for native, they aren't so different.)
The difference usually appears in the ending of the sentence.
For example,,,

I have to go.(English)
私もう行かないと。(standard japanese)
私もう行かなあかん(Kansai-ben)

Most words are the same, so you don't have to worry so much but
I recommend you to study Kaisai-ben in advance. Some difference acutually exists.
Osaka has many many delicious food! XD
But,,,Osaka people tend to speak rahter fast, especially aged ladies.
And Tokyo is also cool city.=D
I hope your good trip.
Source(s):
I'm Japanese.


That's confirm what my friends said to me, you'll definitively find a lot of people talking kansai ben (oral only) in Osaka, which is a big part of Japan.

By searching a bit more, I found some statistics that say 20 millions of japanese would know and use kansai ben (total population in japan would be near 130 millions, so that would make 15% of them).

Of course, in Tokyo (where most tourists go), there is probably not a lot of people using it, as Tokyo is the capital so it use what we call "standard japanese".

Still, this discussion is interesting but don't answer the question about the game (I'll probably have an answer tomorrow by a friend).
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Zio51 » Sun Aug 04, 2013 12:12 pm

Blaw- wrote:By searching a bit more, I found some statistics that say 20 millions of japanese would know and use kansai ben (total population is japan would be near 130 millions, so that would make 15% of them).

This is indeed a lot. I suppose this is more than in the case of France, but I think you would be surprised if you were to go to Alsace or such as it's not uncommon to hear people speak with the specificities of Alsacian french, albeit not everywhere.
I actually did my studies in Metz back then (quite some years now) and I had a friend from Alsace and we went there sometimes with him.

Anyway, true enough it's not nearly in the 15% mark in France but as you mentioned it is mainly oral Japanese and as for written part they use the common language.
I actually went to Osaka for a month for work purpose like 2 years ago but I did not really actively learn Japanese at the time, so I can't really remember if I could pick any subtleties back then.
Also visited a bit, like Kyoto and Nagoya though I wish I had been there for holidays rather than work :p.

Anyway they speak quite fast to be honest so could explain why I did not notice all that much difference but the accent of kansai-ben didn't seem as strong as in TV shows,drama and anime.
Seems to me they emphasize it quite bit more on TV. Perhaps I have become more sensitive to the difference in accents.

Blaw- wrote:Still, this discussion is interesting but don't answer the question about the game (I'll probably have an answer tomorrow by a friend).

Yes sorry about that, it sort of went out of topic lol. As Benoit said I think it is best to just leave those small extra bits out in your localization since I don't think there is any precedent in any localised game in French to translate those small terms.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby BenoitRen » Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:51 pm

Actually, I was trying to argue that a way should be found to work it into the translation because Blaw- wanted to ignore it.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Blaw- » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:13 am

I resumed my work on my french translation after a little break, Aukbal's file is nearly done (only 5 dialogs remaining that I'll do tomorrow).

The whole game translation is actually done at 75% (so +10% since the end of july, when I gave some news about the project, which was then at 65%).

Then, I'll work on Zosa's file, which is half the size of the other towns so it should be quite fast.

After that, all towns in the game will be translated, except one, Ryuon, which will be the last one I'll translate (this one is the biggest one of the remaining ones, once it'll be done, it'll should be pretty fast until the end).

Then, the three last files, Spatioport/Skure, Esper Mansion and Noah Spaceship (the three files are more or less the same size as Zosa, so pretty small) and the translation will be nearly complete after that (the only file I ignored until now is the first one, which is the file where the dialogs of the consult fonction are stored, I plan to do it at the end, as it's less interesting one).

I can't really say it for sure, but I think the translation might be over in a month or two (maybe a bit less, maybe a bit more, it depend of the dialogs. Somes files were pretty easy to translate, some were harder).

Then, my job in this translation will be over (for now, at least, I'll help to beta-test it later on a real PS2) and it will be up to Tryphon to read/correct/modify the translation to get a good script (though I might, as I said before, translate the manual and the cover if someone with good graphics skill offer his help to work on the scans : it would require to first erase all the japanese texts, then rewriting the new text on it once the translation would be ready).

I don't know when the release date might be, but I suppose it might be ready before the end of the year (maybe both version, french and english, might be ready at the same time, as Kyence said a while ago that the english translation will be definitively done before the end of the year).
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Sytakan » Sun Aug 25, 2013 9:31 pm

What worries me is that Kyence hasn't said anything in this topic for a while now. I've been waiting years for a translation to this, it'd be pretty disappointing to see it fall apart. Still, glad to hear the French one is on course, not that it does me any good. XD
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Blaw- » Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:52 am

She doesn't say much here but I can assure it's what she said to me, she's on our private forum dedicated to the translation. So she have access to all the files I translated, if it can help her (as she read french).
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Kyence » Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:41 am

Hello, everyone! It's been a while. Quite a few things have been going on in real life (getting married, now looking for a house, etc.), but I have not abandoned the translation. I did delay on the translation of dialogue a bit as tryphon and blaw were working out some bugs. I am still hoping to get it completed by the end of this year; however, if it does spill over into 2014, I hope no one burns me in effigy I will try to be on with updates less sporadically. Blaw and tryphon have done really nice work, and anybody who can understand French has a great thing to look forward to!

EDIT: Blaw, in GEN1, what I decided to do with the Dezorians, which had two different types of endings to their sentences: liars used one type while those who spoke the truth used a different one. I figured it was a dialect thing, so being a New Yorker-Long Islander myself, I came up with two dialects: one loosely based on old slang ('ya dig?), while the other had a Brooklyn accent (How ya doin'?) I didn't make them 100% accurate at the time lest I be accused of making fun of any group, but I figured it would help players distinguish the liars...which I figured was the point of the accents to begin with.

So, you can do whatever you like...in Gen 2, I wonder if you would see the liar dialect if you wear the Magic Hat versus the Mogic Hat (in the original Genesis version, I remember if you wear the Magic Hat the Dezorians charge you double in the shops...)
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Blaw- » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:40 am

For now, I just removed them. If I remember right, they either end their sentence with "dasu" or "zura" but didn't checked if one was exclusive for the liars and the other one for the ones who say the truth.

Anyway, in the items description, the good hat is labelled as something like "Make you able to understand the Dezolian language" when the other is labelled as "Make you able to understand the Musk Cat language" so it basically seems logical that Dezolians say weird things when you use the hat from the Musk Cat language.

But as I said earlier to him, I already gave the right to Tryphon to change everything he wants once the translation will be over so if he want to add something for the Dezolians, he'll be able to :)
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