Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

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How should the main characters be named in Generation:2 ?

Poll ended at Fri Oct 19, 2012 1:51 am

Use the full Japanese names
28
38%
Use the English Sega Genesis names
40
55%
It doesn't matter
5
7%
 
Total votes : 73

Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby skymandr » Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:12 am

Kyence wrote:There are a few monster names that I can't seem to decide on:

ギ・ル・ザ-ク --> ??? Gil Xak/Gielczak/Gilzak??? I have seen it used as a name on various Japanese sites
ルン・フィン・ガ --> Rune Finger, although it's spelled more like Rune Fin-Ga
ダ・ケムル・ラ- --> ??? Da- Kemuru- ra/la;I have no idea on this one. I am surprised that they have one of the monsters with such an easy name to figure out and not the other two. These are the Fiend/Wizard/Capeone guys.


I think these are meant to sound like strange names, so if it were up to me, I would try not to match them to English words at all. Perhaps Gi Ru Czak, Lun Fin Ga and Da Kemul La (or some other romanisation, with or without hyphens).

Kyence wrote:イッポデホ --> Ippo "Deho"
ホズイトデホ --> Hozuito "Deho"

I see these translated as "Deho" meaning "chief" on this site but I can't seem to figure out how they came up with that. Hozuito was translated as "Fused." I have a feeling I will feel really stupid when someone points out these are right, but I can't verify these on my own. I am wondering if Ippo is a reference to the Ippo that did the music on PSIII and PSIV; she was working at Sega on other projects. There was an employee by the alias of Mizoran who has their name on a set of monsters in this game.


Ippo could be a play on both the person and "number one" I guess (as in "Primary Chief" or something, but my dictionary doesn't have "deho")? I have a Japanese collegue, if you like I can ask him for an Nth opinion. Otherwise, the Sonic Team lead may be a good one to follow. How does hozuito become fused? (my dictionary doesn' have it).

Kyence wrote:プラネットカバ- --> Planet Cover
マンカバ- --> Man Cover
バスカバ- --> ??--> Vas or Bas Cover?


Bus cover, or maybe Bath cover? It's a jelly thing, so I guess it maybe attacks by covering its prey with its slimy corpus... Maybe the smallest one only attacks you when you're having a bath/on the bus?
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Kyence » Thu Jan 31, 2013 11:47 am

Bath Cover...hehehe

The Hozuito = fused was on this site as well, though I can't verify it anywhere else. If you could ask your colleague, that would be a big help!
EDIT:

Thanks, Skymandr. I'm going to use your advice on the odd naming and run with them.

I looked up Bas, which has a meaning in french, "low" or "nether". Based on the naming scheme for this monster, it fits: Planet, Man, Low/Nether, so I'm going with Bas.

I also think I figured out the correct name for Desrona: it's Dethroner. Death Loaner/Loner never really fit the kana, but dethroner does. Living Blade/ Cry Bringer/ Dethroner fits the series. I guess Kingslayer would have been too simple to use for them :lol:
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Searren_sphere » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:22 pm

Like many many many fans, I extend my gratitude and maybe inspiration to the translation team to bring G2 to us. The original is my favorite RPG and I can't wait to play and understand this.

Thank you soooo much for G1!
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Tryphon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 7:35 pm

Kyence wrote:I looked up Bas, which has a meaning in french, "low" or "nether".

Yes, but the "s" is not pronounced, so in katakana it would be "baa" I think.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Paul Jensen » Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:08 pm

Blaw- wrote:
Code: Select all
ノーフ,イビル,マニアっていう階級があるんだって!


Someone have an idea for that?

In the game, it's said there is three types of Motavians ("hierarchy/social class"), it's seems to be "proper nouns".

ノーフ => Norf ?
イビル => ?? (no idea)
マニア => Mania (this one is easy)


ノーフ = 農夫 = "peasant, beggar, farmer, or labo(u)rer"
イビル = "evil"
マニア = "maniac"

The word 階級 in can be "caste", but in the case above it's probably "rank".
Here are some ideas for rendering this set in English

Motavian "wretch", "villian", "maniac"
Motavian "scum", "crook", "psychopath"
or even "Dirty", "Rotten", "Foul" Motavian

HTH
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby skymandr » Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:33 pm

Haha! My colleague solved the riddle! "Ippo" is the nickname for Izuho Numata (沼田 出穂). Her first name, Izuho can also be written as Deho (出=de 穂=ho) and hozui(to) is of course just her name backwards (i-zu-ho -> ho-zu-i), with "to" meaning sort of "and".

As for ノーフ, he didn't know, but he though Paul's suggestion seemed plausible (personally, I think "wretch, villain, maniac" is the best triad of the three proposals).
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Kyence » Sat Feb 16, 2013 11:57 pm

Thanks skymandr! So I guess I was thinking in the right direction. Ippo Deho and Hozui Deho it is, then. I like how they added cameos in the games.

The triad for the Motavians does sound like the humans don't think much of them; is 農夫 really as derogatory as "wretch" or "scum?"
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby skymandr » Sun Feb 17, 2013 1:06 pm

Kyence wrote:The triad for the Motavians does sound like the humans don't think much of them; is 農夫 really as derogatory as "wretch" or "scum?"


I think that's probably the case; MB wouldn't go out of her way encouraging solidarity between the races.

Perhaps "peasant" is better that "wretch"? Both peasant and wretch can be either derogatory or merely descriptive, depending on context, whereas scum is definitely derogatory.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Paul Jensen » Mon Feb 18, 2013 12:33 pm

skymandr wrote:
Kyence wrote:The triad for the Motavians does sound like the humans don't think much of them; is 農夫 really as derogatory as "wretch" or "scum?"


I think that's probably the case; MB wouldn't go out of her way encouraging solidarity between the races.

Perhaps "peasant" is better that "wretch"? Both peasant and wretch can be either derogatory or merely descriptive, depending on context, whereas scum is definitely derogatory.


I think "wretch" or "scum" are probably better choices than "peasant". I don't think anybody could, in good conscience, kill a poor peasant farmer. A wretch could be someone just down on their luck, but is likely just a despicable person. Someone who is scum is just plain bad.

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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby skymandr » Mon Feb 18, 2013 3:04 pm

Paul Jensen wrote:
skymandr wrote:I think "wretch" or "scum" are probably better choices than "peasant". I don't think anybody could, in good conscience, kill a poor peasant farmer. A wretch could be someone just down on their luck, but is likely just a despicable person. Someone who is scum is just plain bad.

HTH


Well, the Palman civilisation does, even under the benevolent rule of MB (long may She reign!), have imperialist feudal aristocratic roots... In an age of high-tech farming, anyone actually digging the earth, might well be prejudiced against, especially if they're not of the dominant race (Palman). "Peasant" might well be derogatory, in that context, as it is sometimes used that way even in our society. Of course, one person's "scum" is ostensibly another persons "family father," hard pressed to make a living under Palman colonial rule, so calling them scum just high-lights the Palman prejudice and fear of the other.

Anyhow, there is nothing saying the player has to kill the Motavians (I never do), and certainly there is nothing inherently bad about giving the player bad conscience over their choices, so I propose to go with the most accurate translation.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Kyence » Fri Mar 01, 2013 1:46 am

Here is my final take on the techniques. You will see some big changes for some technique names. Ones that were used in PSO have had their spellings preserved. Many others have non-English roots. One of the neater ones I found were "Shunera" is likely "Schneller" - German for faster, which is what this spell does [originally referred to as Ner in the game.] The boots bearing the technique's name have also been corrected in my translation. "Shu" is likely "Schutz" - German for protection. Shu boosts defense of a single person. The strangest one, and the one I am the most ambivalent about is "Fanbi." I really think it is a phonetic transliteration of Vampir in the German or Serbian/Croatian language. My reasoning is below. If anybody can contribute any changes to the list I have, let me know. Someone was very multilingual on the PS2 team!

Skills:

トルネード Tornado
バーストタッチ Burst Touch
メディカルトリート Medical Treat
サルファー Sulfur
ナリバーサー Nareverser
リベンジ Revenge
ラストフォース Last Force
ロイヤルガード Royal Guard

---------------------------------------------------
Techniques:

ヒーナス Hinas

リューカー Ryuker

リバーサー Reverser

アンティ Anti

ナサークラ Nasacra
サークラ Sacra (Sacra(fice))

ナサレスタ Nasaresta
ギサレスタ Gisaresta
サレスタ Saresta
ナレスタ Naresta
ギレスタ Giresta
レスタ Resta (PSO)

サシュネラ Sascheneller
シュネラ Schneller (German for faster)

デバンド Deband (PSO)

サシューツ Saschutz
シューツ Schutz (German for protection)

フォルサ Phose/(German pronunciation of phose; it means something
bright and flashing. This spell [Forsa] decreases robot
accuracy. Flashes of light could certainly screw up a
robot's optical sensors.)

シンパロ Shinparo (Japanese "shinpai" = worry; the tech causes a monster to
act differently; I recall it either lowers their defense or
makes them run.)

ドランク Drunk (Decreases monster accuracy; being drunk can certainly do that!)
シーザス Seizures (prevents special biomonster attacks)

サボルト Savolt
ボルト Volt

サジェネラ SaGenera
ジェネラ Genera

ナサガージ Nasagadge
ギサガージ Gisagadge
サガージ Sagadge
ナガージ Nagadge
ギガージ Gigadge
ガージ Gadge (Keinz uses it on robots; Gadge means instrument of
torture)

ジェルン Jellen (PSO)

コンテル Konter (German for counter)

プロセダン Procedon(Esperanto for procedure)

エイジア Ager (English; Keinz uses this on machines)

ファンビア Vampir (I think it's a unique phonetic transliteration of
German or Croatian Vampir, which have subtle
pronunciations. The spell, known as "Fanbi" sucks the
energy out of the enemy and transfers it to the caster,
making it vampiric in nature. Due to the age of the
original game, when distinction between B and V was even
harder for native Japanese speakers to differentiate in
English words, the subtle pronunctiation used for Vampir
could easily be mistaken for an F instead of a V to the untrained ear.)

ナグランツ Nagrants
ギグランツ Gigrants
グランツ Grants (PSO)

ナグラブト Na-Gravito
ギグラブト Gi-Gravito
グラブト Gravito (as in Graviton)

ギサゾンデ Gisazonde
ギゾンデ Gizonde (PSO)
ゾンデ Zonde (PSO)

ナザン Nazan
ギザン Gizan
ザン Zan

ギサバータ Gisabarta
ギバータ Gibarta (PSO)
バータ Barta (PSO)

ナフォイエ Nafoie
ギフォイエ Gifoie
フォイエ Foie (PSO)

ザルア Zalure (PSO)

メギド Megid (PSO)

ムシカ Musika

リミテ Limit
リミタ Limiter

シフタ Shifta (PSO)
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby skymandr » Fri Mar 01, 2013 9:19 am

Very good research, though there are some that I don't quite agree on:

forusa -- Phose is not a German word I've ever heard, and it's not in my dictionary; where did you find it? It seems unlikely -- to me at least -- that they should use such an obscure word. I would rather favour "Falser," as in True/False. This to me sounds like it could be something messing up the machine's logic circuits, which fits the function. It also fits better with Limit and Ager, both English and both to do with robots.

gaaji -- what kind of torture instrument is this (can't find it), and what's it got to do with robots..? Gadge is also an old British English alternative spelling of "gauge," (as in pressure gauge or other measuring devices). This has more to do with machines than a torturer's tool has, so if you want to use gadge, I think this is a better motivation and more plausible etymology...

foie -- I understand that you want to keep PSO names (though I'm not sure I understand why), but this is really the most obviously German tech: Feuer.

limiter, ager, shifta -- if you use the PSO name shifta, there is an internal inconsistency with how you render names. In that case, Limiter should rather be Limita, and Ager... Well that one's tricky... My opinion is that Shifter is preferable to Shifta.

megido -- once again, I disagree with the PSO standard. Megido is a reference to Megiddo.

fanbia -- good find! "v" is pronounced as "f" in German, so Vampir sounds very plausible!

Finally, I feel I should comment on the PSO-names issue: As far as I can see, there is no evidence that whoever decided on the romanisations for PSO was considerably more in the know than we are. Whoever did it was probably not a part of the original team, and very likely did not attempt to make any kind of translation. Therefore, I think treating the PSO-names as sacrosanct is giving them more credit than they deserve. What they do deserve, however, is to be treated the same way as the other names and techs.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Kyence » Fri Mar 01, 2013 12:22 pm

Thank you for those observations, skymandr. As I was doing more of the research, the inconsistencies with the PSO names did irk me. Phose is more of an English sciency term for light, and I saw it in some German research papers that popped up in google, but Falser was my second guess.

I do think I may standardize the PSO stuff at this point: I just kept getting the inclination that many treated the PSO spellings as gospel.

Thanks!
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby BenoitRen » Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:18 pm

Phantasy Star Online's romanisations were more accurate than preceding games's. They just didn't try to look further than that, hence why we're finding references to other languages.

Why are you using the "na" prefix? I recall reading that it was "ra" in Japanese.
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Re: Phantasy Star Generation 2: English Translation

Postby Kyence » Fri Mar 01, 2013 7:09 pm

In ps2 the prefixes were gi and na.
In the Gen1 remake, Ra was used for magic spells. Ra was also used in PSO.
Ra was never used in the original PS series. The kana prefixes are translated as they appear.

Edit: My apologies for the double post. I also found that Grantz is supposed to be the German word "Glanz."
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