Hugh, Kain or Anna? (PSII)

[Zucca]

Kain would stand a chance against Mother Brain, but his best techs are not really that potent to make him all that useful - and a complete waste against DF.

That's not the case at all. NaGaj works just fine against Dark Force.

Is this a bug? Does this also occur on PS Gen II on Playstation?

[don_starlancer]

Well I don't know if its a bug or not but Kain's techs work perfectly against both DF and MB. Actually I think his tech work against most things in the final dungeon Noah anyway, but I have to double check that claim.

[Zucca]

Well I don't know if its a bug or not but Kain's techs work perfectly against both DF and MB. Actually I think his tech work against most things in the final dungeon Noah anyway, but I have to double check that claim.

No need to. They work. I wonder if it works in anywhere else...

[Dorrinal]

P.S.: the first time I played, I took Rolf, Rudo, Anna... and Kain. I am the true hero of this game :^P

I don't understand the Kain hate. He is the best character to take for the final bosses.

Assuming a party of Rolf, Rudo and Anna:

Amy - Amber Robe, Color Scarf, Snow Crown
Hugh - what are you going to do, cast Gifoi?
Shir - Nazan does 100 damage for 11 tp if you get her to 33; otherwise, see Hugh
Kain - Nagaj does 150 damage per turn. Rudo only does 100.

Put the crack pipe down and replace Amy/Hugh with Kain as soon as you get your first healing item out of the dams. You do not need a healer, you do not need to buy Trimate, you do not need to steal Star Mist (ok one Star Mist probably makes Dark Force much easier).

True. But Shir has low attack. And (once again) the Laconian Dagger in Megadrive PSII has that nasty error, so best choice it to equip Shir with Nei Shield and Truth Sleeves. Storm Gear will do the attacking. That's why I'd replace her with Amy... propably.

In my experience, the fourth character uses Storm Gear anyway. Dual-maces on Kain or Hugh just makes me heal them more often so I stick with a shield (ever seen Anna wrecked by Gloswords?). Shir's going first almost every fight so she's a great person to make use of the Storm Gear and Snow Crown.

[Zucca]

I've come to this conclusion:

Code: Select all

Easiest:                Rolf        Rudo        Anna        Amy [SG]
Most damage:            Rolf        Rudo        Shir [NZ]   Kain
2nd most damage:        Rolf        Rudo        Anna        Kain
Less tech dependent:    Rolf        Rudo        Anna        Shir [SG]
Another non-tech party: Rolf        Rudo        Shir [SG]   Amy [SG]
=====================================================================


NG == NaZan, SG == Storm Gear

Some notes:
Each party has Rolf and Rudo. Rudo has such great attack that it causes NaFoi damage each turn after getting NeiShot. Leaving Rudo out just makes game bit harder. And Rolf cannot be left out. ;)
Amy is good in the boss battles for healing (assuming she can use GiSar at least). She can be replaced by Kain or Shir. Shir is better choice in non-boss battles because she's fast and can use storm gear and snow crown. I'd choose her because boss battles aren't much harder with Shir. And if you have grinded some extra exp She knows the secret of NaZan. Also you don't need to leave anyone out while leveling her to steal stuff.

"Another non-tech party" is semi-good in regular attacking and gets bit better when you get the second Storm Gear. But having Anna in place of Shir or Amy has batter results on low-defence (most non-robot) monsters. I'd relace Shir with Anna.
"Most Damage" and "2nd most damage" are a parties that could deliver most damage on monsters on Noah.

In my opinion
You get the second Storm Gear only after you have visited Esper Mansion. So I wouldn't create party based on two Storm Gear users.
Shir learns all the good techs at very late in the game.
Anna is good, and gets even better after dams. I'd keep her (with knife boots to increase her attack). Her attack is bit weaker (at first) than Storm Gear, but I'd give Storm Gear to Amy. This way I can have healer with semi-good attack in my party and Anna with slicers. Two to attack many enemies and two to attack single enemy.
Based on that...
Rolf, Rudo, Amy, Anna is my choice.

Now... I've talked too much. Someone else, please step ahead.

[Dorrinal]

How can you justify ever taking Amy when the fact is you don't need healing techniques?

As intriguing an idea it is to replace Anna with Shir, I don't know if it's worth it to level her up to 33 just to get a useful attack out of her. Maybe if she got Nazan before 30 like Rolf. For reference, the last time I finished PS2 Rolf was my highest level character at 30.

[Zucca]

How can you justify ever taking Amy when the fact is you don't need healing techniques?

Yes. You don't need them, but it makes game easier. Replacing Amy with Shir is an option (for me). She's fast and can be helpful with Snow Crown and Storm Gear.

Hugh is just a waste of resources. His only advantage is that he can be equipped with Lac Maces. Kain's bit better in dams and Noah. But in dams I'd stick with using Storm Gear to save tp.

[Lucid]

You don't really "need" a healer once you have Gires items, but it's more efficient to use one Gisar/Nasar and have everybody else attack than to use everybody's turn up healing themselves. Another advantage is getting the most bang out of Megid. Against Mother Brain I can pretty much use Megid immediately after a Nasar and make quick work of her along with Nagaj and NeiShot.

Of course if you have the time and patience to wait for Shir to steal a few Star Mists then Amy is no longer useful. Then a party of Rolf, Rudo, Kain and Anna would be the best.

I think most of the reason for the "hating" on Kain is that most people aren't aware that Nagaj works on DF and MB.

[Zucca]

I use to use GiSar and NaSar quite often in the dungeons where the Nei equipments reside.
Only if I had a program pad to quickly change everyone to use GiRes equipments. I've been trying to find some kind of program that changes joypad inputs to keyboard keystokes with macro support. I've found only one that might do the thing but it's hard to configure.

[Heroic_Chaz]

Hey, for a challenge beyond any other, don't even go to Rolf's house to get other party members. Anyone who can beat it like that has the luck of the gods or a lot of skill or both. For the greatest challenge EVER, only take Hugh or Kain, get Rolf killed, and solo with one of those two. Bam-o.

[Zucca]

Hey, for a challenge beyond any other, don't even go to Rolf's house to get other party members. Anyone who can beat it like that has the luck of the gods or a lot of skill or both. For the greatest challenge EVER, only take Hugh or Kain, get Rolf killed, and solo with one of those two. Bam-o.

I belive it will be harder with Hugh. Maybe even impossible. Just try to imagine the difficulty on Dark Force and Mother Brain -battles.

[BenoitRen]

For a single character it may be more difficult to get to Dark Force than beating it. Hugh has Vol and Savol for that purpose, though.

[Zucca]

I belive you can manage with Vol techs prior dams quite nicely, but after that you would need loads of TP when battling against bio-mosters on Dezo. Dams itself get bit easier after aquiring any GiRes equipment and Storm Gear.

Anyway (imo), playing like that would be hard and challeging, but most of the time: booring.

[Heroic_Chaz]

I think it's impossible to get through the final dungeon with only Hugh. My stepfather tried, and now I know every curse word ever conceived.

[Dorrinal]

tl;dr I was wrong and Amy is useful; I was right and Kain is fantastic.

I decided to back up what I said earlier and test the effectiveness of different characters on Mother Brain. First of all I leveled everyone to 30; Rolf is 31 because he kept getting too much exp before dying. Here are my observations in no particular order:

• Amy has enough Gisar in her to keep the team going until Rolf runs out of TP
• Two Star Mist is enough to let you drop Amy for a fourth character with better offense but...
• Shir, Hugh and Anna have very little offense to speak of
• Hugh has enough TP to Gifoi until Mother Brain is dead
• On the flipside, Shir has very little TP and goes to Storm Gear very early
• Shir's HP is so low she needs to heal one turn earlier than everyone else. This makes Sar/Star Mist usage inefficient
• Even after a Saner/Colorscarf Anna and Shir move after Mother Brain -- reactive healing is not possible

Here are the characters who bring the strongest offense to Mother Brain, in order:

1. Rolf
2. Kain
3. Rudo
4. Hugh
5. Anna
6. Shir (Below Anna because of low TP)
7. Amy

So the strongest team for defeating Mother Brain would be Kain, Rudo and Hugh (I KNOW!). In practice you don't have 2-4 Star Mist and taking Amy will make your life easier; or if you do, Anna was so useful for the rest of the game that Hugh is still level 1 and you might as well take her instead. Also since Hugh, Shir and Anna put out such terrible damage you're not hurting yourself much by taking Amy.