Any connection between Neifirst and the "real villains&

[Erpy]

Even though the biomonster outbreak quest in PS2 spans about half the game, it seems in some way similar to the first quest in PS4; a "domestic" problem that eventually puts the party on the path of something bigger.<p>People like Zio and Lashiec were pretty obvious cases, as far as motivations went; they gave DF their servitude in exchange for a great deal of magical power, an army of minions and an impressive retreat to boot. In exchange, they served DF in terrorizing Algo and they knew it.<p>Neifirst, on the other hand, seemed to be pretty much all on her own. No special powers to think of (her martial skills notwithstanding), no army of robotpolice/followers and bitterly withering away in Climatrol probably doesn't compare to comfortably sitting in a massive magically built fortress either. Which gives me the impression she's not really aware of something like DF or the PD. Since she hates motavian society, it's rather safe to assume she'd be disgusted by the earthmen/terrans even more.<p>This makes one wonder is how Neifirst, who is apparantly only 2 years old, got so knowledgable about things like recalibrating the Bioplant and Climatrol. In other words, where did she get her "basic Education"? (as Seed put it)<br><p>[size=small][Edit by Erpy on [TIME]1110321268[/TIME]][/size]

[ROMeo]

What little I know about math and computers now, my grandparents may have needed 20 or 30 years to learn it. Educational techniques change, and each passing day learning becomes easier.<p>In a society as advanced as Motherbrain-era's Palma, who knows how advanced their educational techniques could be? For all we know, they might receive it in their sleep and learn in six months what we take 4-6 six years in college to learn.<p>Also remember that plot device called Dark Force, Neifirst was his attemp at creating a suitable body for him (info from the PS Collection), so he keeps a close eye on her, and he might as well have pulled some strings here and there to make it easy for Neifirst to get the knowledge she needed. <p>...if nothing else, it's a fantasy story, not a sci-fi, so there is no need to look for any rational explainations to events.

[Erpy]

In a society as advanced as Motherbrain-era's Palma, who knows how advanced their educational techniques could be? For all we know, they might receive it in their sleep and learn in six months what we take 4-6 six years in college to learn.

<p>Sure, although the notion I brought up was more centered on who should have taught it. Seeing that Climatrol couldn't be stopped after it went nuts, the ability to control it was apparantly not common knowledge.<p>

Also remember that plot device called Dark Force, Neifirst was his attemp at creating a suitable body for him (info from the PS Collection), so he keeps a close eye on her, and he might as well have pulled some strings here and there to make it easy for Neifirst to get the knowledge she needed.

<p>I don't have the PS Collection, so I wasn't aware of that. It kinda collides with the PS Companion's info that the Nei experiment (like Rika's creation) intended to create a humanoid more capable of surviving in an environment more inhospitable than Mother Brain's Motavia.<p>

...if nothing else, it's a fantasy story, not a sci-fi, so there is no need to look for any rational explainations to events.

<p>You're probably right and I'm overanalysing things. My only comfort is that I'm probably not the only one.

[Lord Khyron]

I see this correlation:<p>Phantasy Star 2<p>Biomonster outbreak - Neifirst behind it - Neifirst in Climatrol<p>Phantasy Star IV<p>Biomonster Outbreak - Zio behind it - ZIo blocks Birth Valley<p>o.o the parallel is staggering. I wish we had more ZIo background.

[LaconianShot]

<blockquote>Also remember that plot device called Dark Force, Neifirst was his attemp at creating a suitable body for him </blockquote> <br>Where the hell did you get this? It wasn't in the PSC for GBA... unless you're referring to the other PSC...

[ill-intent]

Just a thought. Earthling plot of conquest in PS2 is make people go soft, then conquer 'em easy. Mother Brain already had people goin' pretty soft, so they make a being to organize the biomonsters to take out the wuss. <p> But to go on the "on her own" bit, I doubt Neifirst actually knew she had anything to do with a larger epic.

[ROMeo]

<blockquote><i>Originally posted by LaconianShot</i><br>Where the hell did you get this?<br></blockquote><p>LOL EXACTLY!!!! IN HELL!!! (taking into account how HELLISH and bad a console the Saturn was). The PS Collection on the Saturn includes the official timeline of events. You can read the translation in http://www.algol-star-system.net/ and it's also floating around somewhere in the Kazaa network.

[Monocromatico]

I always figured Neifirst and numans in general as super-intelligent beings, capable of getting as much knowledge in a year than a people can accumulate in 30. If we take Nei, she doesn´t seem to know much, but it could be associated to the fact that she was found by Rolf when she was only 7 months old (or 7 months prior to PS2? I´m confused). Anyway, she obviously got less time than Neifirst to learn from the supposed source, maybe a Mother Brain terminal made just for instructing numans.

[OpaOpaJr]

<blockquote><i>Originally posted by LaconianShot</i><br>Where the hell did you get this?<br></blockquote><p><blockquote><i>Originally posted by ROMeo</i><p>LOL EXACTLY!!!! IN HELL!!! (taking into account how HELLISH and bad a console the Saturn was). The PS Collection on the Saturn includes the official timeline of events. You can read the translation in http://www.algol-star-system.net/ and it's also floating around somewhere in the Kazaa network.<br></blockquote><p>*sniff* i love my saturn... you hurt my feelings. !@#$ easily one of my top 3 favorite systems. brought out sequels for all the games i loved. they even brought out a sequel for Target Earth on it. and then there were all those other great games i wanted/got on it.<p>*sniff* my feelings! !@#$

[ROMeo]

<blockquote><i>Originally posted by OpaOpaJr</i><br>*sniff* my feelings! !@#$ <br></blockquote><p>Target Earth...wasn't that a genesis game made by Telnet Japan? I'm sure the name rings a bell...<p>And about your feelings I'm deeply sorry.... I'm sorry that you liked the Saturn!!! :p

[Erpy]

Just a thought. Earthling plot of conquest in PS2 is make people go soft, then conquer 'em easy. Mother Brain already had people goin' pretty soft, so they make a being to organize the biomonsters to take out the wuss. <br>But to go on the "on her own" bit, I doubt Neifirst actually knew she had anything to do with a larger epic.

<p>I have my doubts about whether the bio outbreak was a really effective way to take out the wusses. As Alys stated in PS4, bio's tend to avoid residental areas, so unless the wusses go traipsing over the countryside on their own, the casualty rate is likely to be minimal, once the news of a monster outbreak gets out to the public and the government. Zio's really destructive handywork in PS4 was taking out several towns with the help of his army (as well as the long-term effects of soil/climate decline) and not so much the monsters. Still, an outbreak does have its uses for both sides. (for Neifirst; the poetic justice of turning the hunted into the hunter and vice versa. For Mother Brain; the entire palmanian population herded together in just a few towns does have its advantages when you're planning genocide.) Due to Neifirsts own motivations based on personal reasons (bitterness towards the ones who created her), she'd be the perfect front/diversion; would the source of the outbreak be identified and investigated.<p>

I always figured Neifirst and numans in general as super-intelligent beings, capable of getting as much knowledge in a year than a people can accumulate in 30. If we take Nei, she doesn´t seem to know much, but it could be associated to the fact that she was found by Rolf when she was only 7 months old (or 7 months prior to PS2? I´m confused). Anyway, she obviously got less time than Neifirst to learn from the supposed source, maybe a Mother Brain terminal made just for instructing numans.

<p>No doubt about the intelligence. That was basically the point; Neifirst seemingly working alone, yet probably having received her knowledge from someone who took the time to tutor her. Since the deeper point of MB's plan (replacing one human race with another) would probably not interest Neifirst, it's likely she was offered shelter, education and a chance to get even seemingly due to faked sympathy or something.<br><p>[size=small][Edit by Erpy on [TIME]1110367676[/TIME]][/size]

[Benoit]

I think Neifirst was one of Mother Brain's plans. The cause of the bio-monsters was a lot of power of Climatrol going to the Bio-Plant, creating something. It must have been planned out.<br> <blockquote>taking into account how HELLISH and bad a console the Saturn was</blockquote><br>Please restrain your bias and your ignorance.<br> <blockquote>Can someone do something about this guy?</blockquote><br>Just IGNORE him, and wait for Missagh to catch him.

[Erpy]

I'd think it's more than likely the biomonster outbreak was planned out by Mother Brain. (it's hard to imagine the malfunctioning of two of her major systems went unnoticed by her)<p>No matter who was at the root of the initial numan project (be it motavian society or MB/the terrans), due to the experiment being considered a failure, Neifirst was supposed to have been killed right away by those involved in the project. The fact she escaped was not something anybody could have predicted, which leads me to believe Neifirsts role was not something that was originally planned; more of a "convenient occurance". (for MB, that is)

[Siren]

<blockquote><i>Originally posted by Erpy</i> <br>I have my doubts about whether the bio outbreak was a really effective way to take out the wusses. As Alys stated in PS4, bio's tend to avoid residental areas, so unless the wusses go traipsing over the countryside on their own, the casualty rate is likely to be minimal, once the news of a monster outbreak gets out to the public and the government.</blockquote> <p>It wasn't just that. Not only was there Biomonsters, but the land was deteriorating as well, and no law was enforced. <p>The NPC's mention that there has been a lack of rain lately, and that it has been so dry that the lake has evapourated a great deal. Thus, there would be our first factor of extinction...the loss of water would destroy the most basic survival needs: food and water.<p>Next, we have the Scoundrels. Obviously, Mother Brain is <i>more</i> than equipped to deal with threats (A mechanized army was released to destroy Rolf and co.) like the Scoundrels, yet she did no such thing. <p>Finally, we have the Biomonsters. They hadn't attacked the cities...yet. That isn't to say they wouldn't havem though. What if the city happened to have a power outage of some sort, and any defenses that the city had suddenly rendered useless? (an example, of course) My point is that, one way or the next, the Biomonsters would have eventually over-run the cities. <p>Why so gradually, though? Why not kill them all off suddenly? Simply, a mass genocide would have been fast-travelling information, and that would be a chance for resistance. The Earthmen seem to have wanted things in perfect conditions for them (as their conversation with Rolf reveals their desire for Mota). The Earthmen have time, and this gradual extinction (which would take 5 years, at most) leaves the planet in pristine order.<p>By the way, Erpy, welcome to the forums!

[Wosu]

I am sorry to refer to an anime like DBZ but maybe it's like the cyborg story, maybe she killed her creator after having had enought knowledge and unlike in DBZ, as she was the ultimate being, she just felt like giving those biomonster (which are sort of a lot alike her) a chance to live on there own, she might have not stop this biomonster mass production and got respected by them as she understands them so that even if she couldn't raise an army of monsters, she was at least not troubled by them