The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

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The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby Malakai » Thu Feb 10, 2005 1:15 am

<blockquote>P.S. Anyone want to conjecture that the Biomonsters was a calculated plan to bring the last surviving Landale member out in the open to be killed on Gaira?<br></blockquote> <p>Now THAT is an interesting thought. I really like that. It certainly seems like a scheming thing the earthmen and MB would do.<p>And Saner, I am hereby ordaining you to be the forum's jester. You make me laugh more than is sane.
Malakai
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby Lassic's Chllun » Thu Feb 10, 2005 2:16 am

Wow. VERY brilliant and original thought Khyron ~0 .<p>But exactly how deadly did they think flies would be?
Lassic's Chllun
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby Siren » Fri Feb 11, 2005 12:47 am

<blockquote>You forget that the Earthmen could have kept Palmans around as cheap labor/enforcement.</blockquote> <p>Not forgot. Why would they? The Palman's had never worked in their lives. Every technical aspect of their lives was controlled through the Mother Brain, including enforcement. There would be zero need for inferior human labour, which also might revolt. Mother Brain would still be intact, and would sufficiently carry out any labour needed, like she had always done.<p> <blockquote>Anyone want to conjecture that the Biomonsters was a calculated plan to bring the last surviving Landale member out in the open to be killed on Gaira?</blockquote> <p>Nice thought.
Siren
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby Rika/Phoenix » Sun Feb 13, 2005 6:33 pm

<blockquote>It seemed like the Earthmen wanted to slowly kill the people on Mota off, leaving the intstitutions intact so the planet could be "re-booted" later. First, drought and the loss of food production, combined with Biomonsters (can we say Neifirst was caused directly by Mother Brain? I'm in doubt) and the lack of protection of people. An example of this would be the Scoundrels, who Mother Brain was more than equipped to destroy, yet were left unchecked. The Mother Brain certainly shows her muscle when trying to apprehend Rolf and party</blockquote><p>Exactly, Neifirst, in my opinion was a tool, or maybe an experiment of Mother Brain and the Earthmen. She was created to see their reactions to what would happen with the stuff going wrong and the biomonsters taking over Motavia.
Rika/Phoenix
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby AlysBrangwin » Sun Feb 13, 2005 7:00 pm

[quote]Under the living conditions that Mother Brain provided the people of Algol, we can imagine that there was an incredible population increase, like there is with any surplus of food or resources. Of course, this goes beyond a surplus, as the people of Algol were provided with <b>everything</b> needed to flourish.<p>Perhaps that is why there are survivors of the Great Collapse.<br></blockquote><p>But then why is Birth Valley reguarded as where life started in PSIV? <p>The way I figured it was that the populace of Motavia completely or for the most part died out, and using DNA gathered from the Clone Labs, Seed could able to start repopulating the planet using this data once conditions started improving. Since Zelan (and I believe Kuran) was already in place at the time (I guess either as a backup for MotherBrain or to relieve stress on the system.) the scientists who were running Zelan were able to use it/modify it by learning from the technology and adapting it (ala Robotech) and started the slow reconstruction of Motavia's heavy damage. The scientists realized that they would at some point die and leave no one to care for Zelan and thus relair the planet (either due to lack of offspring or life sustaining supplies) created Wren by using technological information they had learned so that Zelan could be run and maintained indefinately after their passing. Once the planet's conditions stablized enough, Seed started churning out the clones.<p>Thee beauty of Phantasy Star is that it allows you to come up with your own beliefs and conclusions instead of just being fed an interactive movie *cough*FinalFantasy*cough*, so there's bound to be people who come to different conculsions. If you don't agree with me, fine. Just don't argue about or insult other people's beliefs, because I feel that goes against the whole spirit of the game/story.<p> :smb: :smb: :smb: <br><p>[size=small][Edit by AlysBrangwin on [TIME]1108321399[/TIME]][/size]
AlysBrangwin
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby LaconianShot » Mon Feb 14, 2005 12:48 am

<blockquote>But then why is Birth Valley reguarded as where life started in PSIV?</blockquote> <br>I should think that this predates PSII and is a reference to where life started eons ago.
LaconianShot
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby Benoit » Mon Feb 14, 2005 1:33 am

But there's no Birth Valley near Zema in PSII... Not even a mountain.
Benoit
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby Siren » Mon Feb 14, 2005 2:43 am

Nice thoughts, Alys. <p>I have some differing thoughts. Birth Valley could be regarded as the place where life started through legends, and nothing more. Perhaps Birth Valley was a facility where animals (much like what were bred for agricultural use and environmental balance in PSII) were engineered. While the humans may not originate from there, if they saw all manners of animals coming out of a mouth of a cave, they could understandably fabricate that Birth Valley was where all life started.<p>Of course, I could be saying utter bullshit. I don't know. I'm not even agreeing with myself. I am simply venturing a thought. We can discuss it and come to a conclusion. <p>
Siren
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby Shell Presto » Mon Feb 14, 2005 3:43 am

<br><blockquote><i>Originally posted by AlysBrangwin</i><p>But then why is Birth Valley reguarded as where life started in PSIV? <p>Once the planet's conditions stablized enough, Seed started churning out the clones.<p>[size=small][Edit by AlysBrangwin on [TIME]1108321399[/TIME]][/size]<br></blockquote><p>Now, I don't think they would use clone lab technology to keep things going. I envision the collapse of society and wars over places with adequate food and water. Those who could not find food died. Those who didn't know how to make shelter died. Maybe they didn't figure out mother brain was gone for a good 10 years until they had too many people and too little food. Then the earth became dry...<p>But eventually things evened out. The was less food, but there was also fewer people. These people were content for a while and had time to think about how to cultivate society again. And they did. The survivors smart enough to be scientists started creating the new control system (or maybe they found it) Seed, and the planet began to flourish again. Heck, they even managed to get water to their landlocked town. (If I remember, Birth Valley is right next to a mountain and has a lake/resevoir thing but no rivers.<p>Anyway, that's how I saw it as being where life started (anew) as a civilization.<br>
Shell Presto
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby LaconianShot » Mon Feb 14, 2005 5:04 pm

<blockquote>But there's no Birth Valley near Zema in PSII... Not even a mountain.</blockquote> <br>True enough. Does this mean that Seed's contruction post-dates PSII? Probably not. Remember, PSII was created <b>before</b> PSIV, so it's safe to assume that the Seed plot hook wasn't in mind. No, it's most likely that Seed's contruction was circa-PSII. That being said...<br><blockquote>The survivors smart enough to be scientists started creating the new control system (or maybe they found it) Seed, and the planet began to flourish again.</blockquote> <br>I'm functioning on the theory that Seed was created by Mother Brain, or in that time period. Seed was not found or created by scientists... "he" was a fully sentient (as we see from PSIV) computer system, and as such, I believe that he orchestrated Motavia's repopulation and resurrection. "He" had the facilities to create new life (see: Rika). This, combined with the fact that "he" is located within a place called Birth Valley suggests that if the Great Collapse wiped out all life (I doubt this very much, though), Seed was charged with repopulating the planet. It's a defenite possibility that Seed had at least aided with the repopulation of Mota. However, I'm going to throw a monkey wrench in my own theory...<p>If Mother Brain, as I suggested, created Seed, (the only possible explanation, really) then why was Seed charged with repopulating Motavia? Mother Brain's eventual plan was to kill off the soft Palmans to make way for the Earthmen. Repopulation contradicts this. Simply put, Seed either went rogue (being that he's sentient, this isn't hard to envision) or he never had anything to do with repopulation <b>directly.</b> Rika, perhaps, was just an experiment. <br>Speculation is welcome. Tear my theory apart if it's warranted. Though, if someone would favor us with Seed's dialogue, I'm sure some light could be shed on this...
LaconianShot
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby KexMex » Mon Feb 14, 2005 6:27 pm

I might be a little dumb, but maybe some technicians, fearing that mota would be slaughtered, created Seed themselves?<p>I dunno... I'm not much of a thinker... :(
KexMex
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby Shell Presto » Mon Feb 14, 2005 7:24 pm

<blockquote><i>Originally posted by LaconianShot</i><p>If Mother Brain, as I suggested, created Seed, (the only possible explanation, really) then why was Seed charged with repopulating Motavia? Mother Brain's eventual plan was to kill off the soft Palmans to make way for the Earthmen. Repopulation contradicts this. Simply put, Seed either went rogue (being that he's sentient, this isn't hard to envision) or he never had anything to do with repopulation <b>directly.</b> Rika, perhaps, was just an experiment. <br>Speculation is welcome. Tear my theory apart if it's warranted. Though, if someone would favor us with Seed's dialogue, I'm sure some light could be shed on this...<br></blockquote><p>I think you are discrediting the people of Motavia to an extent. I mean Mother Brain herself was created by humans. Maybe I just don't want to believe that they people of Motavia learned nothing from Rolf's sacrifice. I mean, what, they had a great collapse and then Seed kicked in and gave resources to anyone lucky enough to survive? I'd like to think that Seed was only known by a few really great scientists. People like the Professor of Motavia Academy (because the scientists who worked with Seed knew its potential for harm and didn't want anyone with intentions like Zio or the Earthmen to create biomonsters again... but then they didn't know of Dark Force). <p>So then when things got going okay again, they put Seed on autodrive and closed off the cave. Then Rika was born, perhaps so that if things got out of hand she could be around to fix them when she got older.<p>Anyway, that's at least what I like to believe. <br>
Shell Presto
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby LaconianShot » Mon Feb 14, 2005 9:02 pm

<blockquote>I think you are discrediting the people of Motavia to an extent. I mean Mother Brain herself was created by humans.</blockquote> <br>Yes, I am discrediting them. Mother Brain was built by <b>humans</b>, not Palmans. The Earthmen created Mother Brain to lead Palmans down the path of destruction. The Palmans became pampered and decadent under Mother Brain's rule. It would've been nothing for the Earthmen to slaughter the weak people that the Palmans had become, and to take Motavia for themselves. Remember, that was Mother Brain's purpose.<br><blockquote> Maybe I just don't want to believe that they people of Motavia learned nothing from Rolf's sacrifice.</blockquote> <br>Seems unlikely that they would. In their eyes, Mother Brain was benevolent... life under her "rule" (I doubt the Palmans used such an ugly word... more like "guidance" ) was easy. Rolf and co. <i>destroyed</i> a benevolent presence in their life... they would not see his sacrifice, they would see the "evil" in destroying a caring and loving entity. The Palmans were not aware of the malevolence behind Mother Brain... nor did they have cause to be. They only ever benefited because of Mother Brain, so naturely would trust and even love "her". Rolf's destruction of Mother Brain would plunge them into confusion and chaos. People that had never in their life worked would have to work. Their every need would go unattended. Would they see the good in Rolf's sacrifice? Not a chance.<p>[size=small][Edit by LaconianShot on [TIME]1108415035[/TIME]][/size]
LaconianShot
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby Benoit » Mon Feb 14, 2005 11:02 pm

<blockquote>True enough. Does this mean that Seed's contruction post-dates PSII? Probably not. Remember, PSII was created before PSIV, so it's safe to assume that the Seed plot hook wasn't in mind. No, it's most likely that Seed's contruction was circa-PSII. That being said...</blockquote><br>It's possible that the land has changed in those 1000 years, causing the mountain to appear. That would explain it partly. :)<p>As for Seed himself...<p><blockquote>(in the scene of meeting Rika)<p>ALYS: Those ears... What on earth are you? And what is this place!?<p>RIKA: This is the Bio-plant. It's a research facility for bio<br> engineering created by a thousand-year old civilization.<p>(later)<p>SEED: I am 'Seed', the control computer for this Bio-plant.</blockquote><br>Yup, Seed was definitely created before PSII.<br><blockquote><br>(about Rika)<p>SEED: She is...my child.<p>HOLT: Are you saing that she is an artificial life form?<p>SEED: That's right. She is a product of a thousand years of improvement<br> on genetic information from a prototype prior to the 'Great<br> Collapse.' I have also given her a basic education. She will<br> surely be a great help to you.</blockquote><br>But, whatever reason he had for doing this research and for creating her, is unknown. Maybe it was his job as part of a research facility.<p>As for him trying to help the planet, I think it is because Wren took over shortly after the Great Collapse.
Benoit
 

The true ending of PSII. (spoilers)

Postby Malakai » Tue Feb 15, 2005 12:44 am

Ok, since I just skimmed over all those posts, I hope not to repeat anything that has already been said. It was indeed obvious from Rika's statements that MB had created Seed. However, Wren mentions later ro Daughter that the Palmans survived without AI assistence. This makes sense considering MB's and the Earthmen's intentions, and so goes along with the idea that Seed didn't help with repopulating the planet. In fact, I doubt that Seed had very little to do with the Palmans those 1000 years.<p>It's not unfeasable either that the Biosytems is right up against Zema now. After all, 1,000 years have passed and as Chaz learns at the academy as well as along the journey, when the Great Collapse hit, Mota got SCREWED. A geographical change is a perfectly logical explanation.
Malakai
 

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