About Lutz and Noah...

[LegoMuskCat]

Sorry, had to do this since this thread seems to be very controversial on this subject!

As for my belief, I think Noah and Lutz to be one in the same. Those silly translators, have they no shame!?

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it must be a duck. If we apply this to Lutz and Noah, then viola! It's the same person, unless you wish to argue that it could simply be another variety of bird.

[BenoitRen]

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it must be a duck.

I wanted to say the same thing that other day, but didn't.

[IndispensablePeaGuy]

Mike Ripp is a troll.

That is all.

[PSP]

Lutz is Lucifier, a fallen archangel.

Obviously.

-Corey

[Dorrinal]

Who knows if there would be much of a PS community without pointless debates like this one?

And why do some people get so angry or offended during these things, anyway?

Mike Ripp is a troll.

That is all.

You should try taking up his position on Noah and Lutz some time. It's far more effective than calling people names and claiming "PS2 Sucks!"

[Lord Khyron]

Dorrinal.. All we have to do is look at PS IV.

RUNE is his name. He is the 5th Generation "LUTZ"

Now, NOAH is his name, he is the 1st Generation "LUTZ"

How hard is that to comprehend? Rune is known as LUTZ to most of his followers.

[Dorrinal]

Khyron, you're in the wrong thread. You know we can tell when you post before you take your medication, right?

[Lord Khyron]

I am in the right topic. Those who answered "Different" should read my post.

The post is quite contextual for the situation.

LOL I don't take medicine my friend.

[IndispensablePeaGuy]

Who knows if there would be much of a PS community without pointless debates like this one?

And why do some people get so angry or offended during these things, anyway?

Mike Ripp is a troll.

That is all.

You should try taking up his position on Noah and Lutz some time. It's far more effective than calling people names and claiming "PS2 Sucks!"

Omg, you are a computer programmer with godly intelligence: I am not worthy!

...Assuming that I really give a flying fuck?

If the topic in question was really worth my full attention, I would use reasonable debating tactics than ad hom attacks. Right now, I'm bored and therefore passing the time with low-key trolling.

[LaconianShot]

Well, I posted something last night after voting, but PS Cave ate my response OM NOM NOM style, so here it, more or less, again.

I think it's a stretch even to suggest that Noah is his name and he is the first generation Lutz. It's a sight more logical than saying they're different people, but you're still dodging the obvious failure on the part of the translators. Occam's razor... the simplest answer is usually the correct one. Phantasy Star was translated back when translations were all rather spotty. A lot of the time, names of people and objects were anglicized to accomodate a fickle English-speaking market. Lutz was likely translated as Noah for a sake of familiarity... most English speaking countries are largely Christian, so the name "Noah" would've been familiar to almost everybody. Either that, or the change was completely arbitrary, which is also a possibility since translators were given a reasonable amount of leeway.
However, reasoning away a translation error, to me, seems like a waste of time. We can come up with backstory and whatnot all we like, but more than likely it's a translation error.

[Thanatos]

I voted other, but for good reason.

Noah and Lutz are the same in spirit only. While appearing similar physically, it's not to say that the future generation Lutz, Rune Walsh, does not ALSO share physical similarities.

It's possible that when Noah realized the emergence of the Dark Force would happen again, and knew his life could only be sustained so long with cryogenic stasis, he CRAFTED the telepathy ball as a way to save all his knowledge and abilities, and after doing-so, could teach others, and ensure that someone else could gain his knowledge. He may have planned to create an army of espers to battle or contain the darkness in the event other warriors couldn't be found, or perhaps it was just to find a proper 'heir'.

Though if we want to be funny, I could say that Lutz IS Noah, and merely changed his name when he realized the earthmen would cause the destruction of Parma, and didn't want history to write that 'Noah' caused the deaths of trillions. XD

The simplest answer is that in PSII, they call him Lutz, because that's his TITLE, not his name. In PSIV, they call him "Reverent Lutz", but it's possible they never actually KNEW his name. The only one that seems to know who Rune is, by name AND title, would be the older man in the inner sanctum. The Espers look up to their leader, a leader with the title of 'Lutz'.

Eh, so that's my two cents. *plink! plink!*

[dragonlord]

I voted other, but for good reason.

Noah and Lutz are the same in spirit only. While appearing similar physically, it's not to say that the future generation Lutz, Rune Walsh, does not ALSO share physical similarities.

It's possible that when Noah realized the emergence of the Dark Force would happen again, and knew his life could only be sustained so long with cryogenic stasis, he CRAFTED the telepathy ball as a way to save all his knowledge and abilities, and after doing-so, could teach others, and ensure that someone else could gain his knowledge. He may have planned to create an army of espers to battle or contain the darkness in the event other warriors couldn't be found, or perhaps it was just to find a proper 'heir'.

Though if we want to be funny, I could say that Lutz IS Noah, and merely changed his name when he realized the earthmen would cause the destruction of Parma, and didn't want history to write that 'Noah' caused the deaths of trillions. XD

The simplest answer is that in PSII, they call him Lutz, because that's his TITLE, not his name. In PSIV, they call him "Reverent Lutz", but it's possible they never actually KNEW his name. The only one that seems to know who Rune is, by name AND title, would be the older man in the inner sanctum. The Espers look up to their leader, a leader with the title of 'Lutz'.

Eh, so that's my two cents. *plink! plink!*

i agree completely...lutz is a title that rune currently holds

[Danny]

I think Noah is Lutz. The memories of the former Lutz generations pass down them down to the new generation. The name of the current Lutz may change but it's still is Lutz so to speak. Kind of like the avatar who keeps reincarnating. Each generation/reincarnation is the same person even if he/she is born elsewhere and with a different overall physical body and attitude. Rune is a tad less serious than Noah who never cracked a joke as far as I can remember.

[LegoMuskCat]

Noah and Lutz are the same in spirit only. While appearing similar physically, it's not to say that the future generation Lutz, Rune Walsh, does not ALSO share physical similarities.

Like a reincarnation? I believe this to be true for Rune, but not for Lutz/Noah, since the translation's skewed.

It's possible that when Noah realized the emergence of the Dark Force would happen again, and knew his life could only be sustained so long with cryogenic stasis, he CRAFTED the telepathy ball as a way to save all his knowledge and abilities, and after doing-so, could teach others, and ensure that someone else could gain his knowledge. He may have planned to create an army of espers to battle or contain the darkness in the event other warriors couldn't be found, or perhaps it was just to find a proper 'heir'.

Hmm. The idea of some Esper army seems uncharacteristic of what Lutz stood for, IMO.

This bit from PSIV should clear this up:

RUNE: Before he died, he left his will and memory in the Telepathy Ball.
RIKA: Then... you're saying that this ball is Lutz?
RUNE: No. He's not here now. But if the chosen person appears, then
Lutz's will and memory will be transfered to that person.

The simplest answer is that in PSII, they call him Lutz, because that's his TITLE, not his name.

I disagree. I think that is his name, as the translators translated it as such.

[Del_Ian]

Noah == Lutz, period, end of story.

Real reason: The translation is borked. (I don't buy the 'seperate PSes' bull, so for me it's not even an issue - Lutz is unambiguously Lutz in the JP version of the games. Hence, there's not even a reason to debate the issue.)