My super computer is so much more awesome than game consoles

[The HuBBs]

actually the pc port of the 1st TR looked way better tahn teh SS or psone versions. I have it.

And despite your constent claims that looks aren't everything, what about controls? I find that most games handle way better on the PC than their console counter part. FPS', RPG's, Adventures and platformers all play much easier with a mouse and keyboard.

[BenoitRen]

I have the PC port of Tomb Raider too. Doesn't look that much better. Unless you apply the 3D card patch, of course.

Eh, keyboard and mouse isn't that good of a combo, in my opinion. It's really awkward to aim with your mouse. Not to mention having to use arrow keys or WASD instead of an analog nub. Even a D-pad would be better.

Still, though they're awkward, until the Wiimote, it was the best people had for FPSs. But for other genres, save RTS? The gamepad is king! Platform games with a keyboard? Yuck! I wouldn't even consider it unless I didn't have a gamepad hooked up.

[Aolish]

That's nuts. There is absolutely no point in running a PC game at that resolution. Your eyes can't see the difference between that and 720p unless you happen to have a huge monitor. Like, bigger than 32", which I doubt.

Then obviously its either you can't see very well or the display you are using really needs to be upgraded. Seriously you can't say you can't tell the difference between 720p or higher? I've seen gears run at 1920x1080 with everything maxed and it puts a 720p to shame! come on!

The eye candy again.

Alright, enough with the eye candy comment. First off I never said once in my post that i prefer eye candy over game play. On the contrary its the exact opposite. I'd take gameplay over eye candy any day. Plain and simple. No point in playing a game if it isn't fun to play.

Is there anything substantial that's better?

Far Cry is the PERFECT example. The game is recognize as having one of the largest map in FPS. I can't really name one FPS game that has maps like far cry in terms of sheer size, maybe Crysis. Far Crys port to the XBox was a totally different ball game. Since developers had to make due to what they had they had no choice but to cut MOST of the maps down to puny extremely linear maps so the XBox can better handle the game. This just totally blew the whole point of the game out of the water so badly they actually had to change the title of the game. Far cry was known for its exploration of going where ever you want. XBox Far Cry seems like a regular action based game then being an open ended game.

DirectX is a programming layer. It does not automatically make games prettier or more performant.

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/pcs/directx- ... 243099.php

Flight Simulator X looks totally different under DX10. Granted its not an actual screenshot of the game, but the picture clearly shows that there IS that much of a difference between dx9 and dx10. Also I've seen Crysis in DX9 vs DX10 and there is a difference.

Here's an example: The Sega Genesis/Mega Drive had a CPU of about 7.5 Mhz. What did the PC port of Sonic 3 & Knuckles need? 75 Mhz, 90 Mhz recommended.

What about the game Tomb Raider? The PSX had a 33 Mhz CPU, and the Sega Saturn had a 21 Mhz one with a bunch of extra CPUs. The PC port, which didn't look that much better, needed much higher specs compared to the game consoles.

It's all about the architecture. In this case, it wasn't just a Pentium III. It has SIMD extensions. The graphics card was custom-made.

It doesn't matter if the GPU was custom made. It still borrowed a lot of the technologies the NV20 had + added a little more flair to it which called it the N2A. Other then that iits an almost exact duplicate of the GF3. Also last I checked the graphics card is one of the main reasons for visuals. Not the processor. The processor is there for the speed of the game and Unreal Engine 2 was no exception to that rule. UE2 was one of the most CPU intensive engines when it was released. A 2 GHZ was barely enough for it much less a 733mhz. It needed a really fast processor to get the most out of it. Most of its visuals were taken straight out of DX9 based cards. UE2 came out with a whole host of visuals and features that the GF3 just couldn't do since it was strictly a DX8 gpu. UE2 was 2 years ahead of what the GF3 could do. If UE2 came out 2 years before the NV20 then that would be a different story but it didn't. It came out 2 years after NV20. The NV20 was barely able to handle anykind of vertex, geometry and pixel shaders back then much less handling what UE2 had + MORE! So how can a GPU do what its suppose to do if a game engine never existed? I can see this discussion is going to head no where. So I'll be the first person to drop the subject.

[Aolish]

Eh, keyboard and mouse isn't that good of a combo, in my opinion. It's really awkward to aim with your mouse. Not to mention having to use arrow keys or WASD instead of an analog nub. Even a D-pad would be better.

It can't be compared, not by a long shot. You do know that many of the FPS games on the XBox 360 have much larger hit boxes and auto-aim to help compensate for the use of analog. Without the added help it would be next to near impossible to aim without the larger hit boxes and auto-aim assists.

[Neo48]

I was going to quote a lot of stuff, but I decided against that.

Anything involving an arguement about graphics seems to be opinionated. Like always they are pointless.

Want your PC to feel like a console? Plug an Xbox 360 controller into it. Problem solved.

This may blow a few peoples minds; some people actually LIKE modding their PCs.

Consoles are upgraded just like a PC. The difference is how they are upgraded. What do upgrades seem to consist of? New technology. Over a period of time, new technology is introduced to both PCs and consoles.

If you don't like patches for the PC then stay away from the Wii. System updates have proved more of a problem then a blessing to me. (Please don't diss my internet connection, it is perfectly fine).

And finally, my punctuation will always be half-assed when on a forum. I'll abuse the apostrophe as much as I damn well want to.

[BenoitRen]

Then obviously its either you can't see very well or the display you are using really needs to be upgraded. Seriously you can't say you can't tell the difference between 720p or higher? I've seen gears run at 1920x1080 with everything maxed and it puts a 720p to shame! come on!

It has nothing to do with the eyes. It's a fact. The human eye can't see the difference between 720p and 1080p, unless the screen is really large (32" or bigger).

Since developers had to make due to what they had they had no choice but to cut MOST of the maps down to puny extremely linear maps so the XBox can better handle the game.

Is this just your guess, or is there an interview or something where they say this? Because otherwise I have to assume they were just incompetent in porting the game.

Flight Simulator X looks totally different under DX10. Granted its not an actual screenshot of the game, but the picture clearly shows that there IS that much of a difference between dx9 and dx10. Also I've seen Crysis in DX9 vs DX10 and there is a difference.

That's misleading. First, we don't know if they were rendering with the same video card. Secondly, the DirectX 10 screenshot shows a couple more graphical effects. Again, DirectX is a programming layer. Such effects could be accomplished with DirectX 9 and a card that supports those effects.

It doesn't matter if the GPU was custom made. It still borrowed a lot of the technologies the NV20 had + added a little more flair to it which called it the N2A.

Other than what was added, it's still the same card? No way! Custom-made does matter. It's optimised for the XBox!

Also last I checked the graphics card is one of the main reasons for visuals. Not the processor.

Weren't you going to quit the eye candy argument?

The processor is there for the speed of the game and Unreal Engine 2 was no exception to that rule. UE2 was one of the most CPU intensive engines when it was released. A 2 GHZ was barely enough for it much less a 733mhz.

Apples and oranges. You're trying to compare a PC CPU with a game console CPU. Also, the Unreal 2 engine can be optimised much better on a game console than a PC. Not to mention how PC game developers these days slack off when it comes to quality code. No doubt it could run more efficiently.

The rest of your argument is eye candy again. :/

I can see this discussion is going to head no where. So I'll be the first person to drop the subject.

Which is why you first posted a big reply, right? And an extra reply after that post?

It can't be compared, not by a long shot. You do know that many of the FPS games on the XBox 360 have much larger hit boxes and auto-aim to help compensate for the use of analog.

Read my post more carefully. I'm comparing the analog nub with the arrow keys and WASD. For moving around, see. No doubt the mouse is more precise for the actual aiming and shooting.

Want your PC to feel like a console? Plug an Xbox 360 controller into it. Problem solved.

How they feel is not the argument here. And to be able to use the XBox 360 controller, you need Windows XP and the drivers which aren't included by default.

Consoles are upgraded just like a PC. The difference is how they are upgraded. What do upgrades seem to consist of? New technology. Over a period of time, new technology is introduced to both PCs and consoles.

That's not upgrading, that's a new product.

And finally, my punctuation will always be half-assed when on a forum.

Etiquette, please. Internet message boards are not some dump where you can drop your manners. You learned how to spell for a reason.

[IndispensablePeaGuy]

Gaming consoles have a lot of restrictions, where as PC's have all the freedom you need to do what you like.

First, please don't abuse the apostrophe.

Major writing errors are one thing, but to correct him on minor ones doesn't make him less of a good writer. As long as he/she manages to put across a good argument on an internet forum topic (something that the reader can understand), who cares if he accidentally uses an apostrophe when he should not?

Now I can see why people on Intensity think I'm an uber-wanker at times.

[BenoitRen]

Occasional writing errors are one thing, but making common, silly errors does not make someone less of a good writer.

Do take note that he has admitted to not making an effort to write properly on message boards. It's one thing to make the occasional typo, but not making any effort at all is just sad.

[IndispensablePeaGuy]

Occasional writing errors are one thing, but making common, silly errors does not make someone less of a good writer.

Do take note that he has admitted to not making an effort to write properly on message boards. It's one thing to make the occasional typo, but not making any effort at all is just sad.

As long he makes himself clearly understood in his writing, his unwillingless to correct minuscule punctuation errors on the internet should not be an issue.

In summary, give the lad a break: he made the effort to appear intelligent in his argument.

[Forge]

who cares if he accidentally uses an apostrophe when he should not?

I do! Studying English at university does that to you.

However, during an argument, punctuation should not matter: the skills of putting across the argument is the issue.

Unfortunately, misuse of punctation can lead to the incorrect message being put across. In this case:

where as PC's have all the freedom you need to do what you like,

the problem is that a missing word is suggested. Obviously PC's could not stand for PC is because the phrase is followed by a verb. Instead, the meaning of the apostrophe suggests possession. And since there is no object for possession, the meaning of the sentence detracts. The PC's what have all the freedom? Their monitors? Their souls? Their owners?

This is where the problem resides, but unfortunately, unless this is a document set out in academic style, following MHRA style guidlines, the punctuation issue is irrelevant.

Especially considering most people have issues with acronyms anyway, and that their spell-checker will often automatically fix this problem.

Nonetheless, this is all somewhat off topic, and not desired to be a slur on anyone. However, I do feel strongly about punctuation. This often proves more useful when I can spend a couple of hundred words of a four-thousand word essay talking about four colons...

As long he makes himself clearly understood in his writing, his unwillingless to correct minuscule punctuation errors on the internet should not be an issue.

This is true. It is widely recognised that the internet is a conversational medium, where meaning should rather be taken from aural context than visual.

Hmm...

Sorry for derailing the thread!

Nonetheless, I don't care what is the best at playing something. I still play on my Master System, so technical refinements mean little to me. Especially with sales pitches coming from working at GAME, numbers and letters mean little to me: especially when I have to change an apparent opinion in order to better sell what the person wants!

[Neo48]

Who knew the apostrophe had such power! I'm sure most people here will agree (and as some have mentioned), the arguement is more important than the punctuation. I would also expect that someone as yourself who favours international message boards would be more leniant to spelling and gramar.

Eh, keyboard and mouse isn't that good of a combo, in my opinion. It's really awkward to aim with your mouse. Not to mention having to use arrow keys or WASD instead of an analog nub. Even a D-pad would be better.

How they feel is not the argument here. And to be able to use the XBox 360 controller, you need Windows XP and the drivers which aren't included by default.

I think it's safe to say that 90%+ people who play games on PCs use Windows OS. As for the drivers...they will take a lot less time to download than the Wii system update I need to be able to re-enter my Shopping Channel.

That's not upgrading, that's a new product.

lol

[BenoitRen]

I would also expect that someone as yourself who favours international message boards would be more leniant to spelling and gramar.

Quite the opposite! Good punctuation is important for people who are learning English. Also, 'foreigners' often know English better than native speakers!

This is a textual medium, so putting care into the text is important.

I think it's safe to say that 90%+ people who play games on PCs use Windows OS.

Irrelevant. It's still an extra requirement. What about people who want to play PC games but use GNU/Linux? They're screwed most of the time. See my argument about lack of standardisation.

As for the drivers...they will take a lot less time to download than the Wii system update I need to be able to re-enter my Shopping Channel.

But you still need to download them. No such issue with game consoles. Just pop in and play. That's the point.

Who knows you even need WGA to be able to download those drivers. That's another extra requirement.

I hadn't even mentioned that you would have to pay for the XBox 360 controller on top of your PC and its required peripherals.

[IndispensablePeaGuy]

Quite the opposite! Good punctuation is important for people who are learning English. Also, 'foreigners' often know English better than native speakers! Razz

This is a textual medium, so putting care into the text is important.

Punctuation is fundamental to English writing, yes; but this concept usually applies to formal writing. On the internet, writing standards on a message board are not as strict as writing for a newspaper or your own novels. Moreover, most people in their mother tongue -- French, Japanese, English, etc -- don't particularly care if someone within their demograph makes a minor inaccuracy in grammar -- or punctuation if we're on the subject of writing.

In conclusion, bitching about people's linguistic skills are just ad hom arguments which do nothing but derail into a pissing contest of who's the greater grammar, spelling & punctuation nazi.

Who cares?

[Neo48]

Agreed

Irrelevant. It's still an extra requirement. What about people who want to play PC games but use GNU/Linux? They're screwed most of the time. See my argument about lack of standardisation.

I can see why you say that, however, Microsoft's firm grasp (a monopoly even) on the PC gaming community makes my arguement totally relevent (When I think about how many times I've seen Linux or GNU being used I can't recall any such a situation). Therefore, to rule out other operating systems is a fair judgement. The lack of standardization is irrelevent because it is not the PC that changes, but the OS. So, what difference is there to play a game on a Linux OS than a Windows OS if the PC parts are going to be the same? A PC will perform the way the hardware permits it and the hardware is determined by the user (Gaming).

But you still need to download them. No such issue with game consoles. Just pop in and play. That's the point.

Then I guess it is fair to say that Nintendo missed the point with the Wii in this area.

I hadn't even mentioned that you would have to pay for the XBox 360 controller on top of your PC and its required peripherals.

What peripherals? USB slots? Those are so common nowadays due to their mass usage with things like webcams, printers, scanners, digital cameras...it would be rare to see a PC or laptop not equipped with such technology.

As for cost, I believe it is a small price to pay, especially since I am unable to buy games like PSU for the Wii, or some third party Wii games that do not have online play. I also do not own a 360. If the cost of a controller is too much for one to handle then that is their problem. Jobs aren't exactly hard to come by these days.

[Lord Khyron]

Not giving a damn about Grammar is the reason you have all those kids who WRITE their entrance essays in CHAT speech/Shorthand/bad net grammar and have to have their teachers FIX the papers. The same reason most college freshman need a remedial english class.

Same with all the kids and college students who can't write a decent paper anymore.

When standards become lax, society suffers.

For most people, their first PUBLIC appearance on the net is usually in ALL CAPS, BAD SPELLING, 1337 speech and what does that tell you about a person?